I returned to Trump over the past few days to gain an insight into the thinking of his followers who suggest they are conservatives when they are really Trumpers and QAnons which is a totally different thing. I wondered what they thought about and how they justified the January 6, 2021 attack on our Capitol after three months. Fortunately looking around I found some of them who spelled it out.
These people do not want to address the how and why of the January 6 attack. That would be inconvenient. I suggest you can take judicial notice that It came about because Trump asked his supporters to come to DC on that day because it was going to be “wild.” Mr. Trump tweeted on Dec. 19, “Big protest in D.C. on January 6th” He urged his followers to come:
“Be there, will be wild!”
What did Trump mean by that? As one article had it: “For weeks, President Trump and his supporters had been proclaiming Jan. 6, 2021, as a day of reckoning. A day to gather in Washington to “save America” and “stop the steal” of the election he had decisively lost, but which he still maintained — often through a toxic brew of conspiracy theories — that he had won by a landslide.
And when that day came, the president rallied thousands of his supporters with an incendiary speech. Then a large mob of those supporters, many waving Trump flags and wearing Trump regalia, violently stormed the Capitol to take over the halls of government and send elected officials into hiding, fearing for their safety.”
It is hard to disagree with that statement. The internet was full of folk tweeting about going to D.C. on the 6th. There were tweets talking about arming themselves. I cannot see how those tweets would go unnoticed by the Trump administration.
Hold your horses the Trump revisionist are now saying. They explain, as one had it, “What did Trump and his protesters want? Merely a delay in finalizing delegates; the delay, they hoped, would result in fairer recounts.”
I ask how were they planning to bring about this delay? If they were there because it was going to be “wild” then they had to be planning something special. That, of course, was to storm the Capitol for only by doing that could they have achieved their goal.
All who watched Trump’s actions after he lost the election well knew that by January 6 every contested election had a recount, some more than one. Didn’t Georgia have three or four. Were the recounts only going to be fair if Trump, like he did, called up the state officials and demanded that “they find” enough votes to give him the victory in the state and the election officials cheated to do that? Does the term “fairer recounts” mean counting the ballots over and over again until miracle of miracle the winner changes?
January 6 was 14 days before the inauguration of January 20. No recounts were scheduled between those dates. When were these “fairer recounts” supposed to take place? They could not happen before the inauguration. How long were we to wait until the Trump folk would agree they lost? We have a pretty good idea of that because now, more than five months after he lost, they have yet to accept that. Would we still be waiting to finalize the delegates?
Obviously the protesters were not interested in delay. They wanted to stop any recount. They wanted to stop the certification of Biden as the winner. They knew they could only do this by force. But what remains a mystery is if they had done that, what did they expect next? Did they really believe Trump could remain president until “fairer recounts” were done past his end date of January 20? Was that to be done as suggested by QAnon General Flynn by declaring martial law?
The idea that the people who invaded the Capitol and were held back by police pointing guns at them to allow the elected representatives in the Senate and House to go off to safe locations were only interested in a delay is preposterous. But it is only the first step in minimizing the Capitol attack. The next attempt to do so is to suggest the insurrection was much ado about nothing.
Maybe counting flags will help.
I do not know if you watched this crime as it played out on tv but it is far different than what I saw. It was text book terrorism, pure and simple. A mob supported a cadre bent on using violence to inflict their will upon legal processes that govern our society. These terrorists came prepared to accomplish aims by instilling fear on the Congress. Preparations that were made far in advance of the “wild” time.
The “all they wanted ” excuse is laughable.
…you lost me at brilliant Constitutional lawyers like Powell…..
Michigan AG, Dana Nessel is asking Sidney Powell the question on everyone’s mind: “If no reasonable person would believe you, then why are you filing lawsuits based on those claims?” They’re using her own words against her to disbar her.”.
Hutch, we’ve watched the same video, watch and read different news sources. I disagree with your conclusory statements. From a video you can distinguish a spontaneous riot from a planned violent uprising? I can’t agree with the assessments about pro-Trump supporters’ actions and motives by biased liberals who’ve thrown mud at Trumpers for four years. See 4-15 response.
Admit: You are a liberal and you despise Trump and his supporters. I admit I support Trump’s policies as I supported Reagan’s policies.
At least, you’ll concede that of the 100,000 plus on the Mall, only 400 have been arrested (3 months later) and only a few score (40) have been charged with conspiracy.
You put the cart before the horse. You conclude a “cadre” is leading thousands. Within thousands were a few disassociated violent men, who acted individually not in concert with many and certainly not in concert with most: veterans, doctors, teachers, policemen, politicians, local public servants, all-Americans from every walk of life. Hundreds or thousands of American flag bearers were there. Of course, hundreds waved Trump flags. They were mainly Trump Supporters.
You can’t impute to many, because a few have made inflammatory comments before, during or after the riots. That’s classic “guilt by association”.
I heard one report that the FBI was accusing a women (Ashli Babbitt) of “tweeting comments” to Fox News.
Who is overreacting?
Anyway, I’m glad your finding my comments “laughable”. I’m not sure, though, you’ve quoted me correctly or in context.
Newsflash: Congressional Delegates and Trump supporters were seeking a delay. Trump said two days. Trump said he’d peacefully transfer power. (See below.)
Remember, too, Trump was acquitted of inciting violence. Remember, a few at the Capitol are charged with personal violent acts. A small percentage charged with destruction of property or theft of property (one walked away with an envelope)
Remember Trump’s words on January 7, 2021, after Congress confirmed Biden’s election:
“Even though I totally disagree with the outcome of the election, and the facts bear me out, nevertheless there will be an orderly transition on January 20th. I have always said we would continue our fight to ensure that only legal votes were counted. While this represents the end of the greatest first term in presidential history, it’s only the beginning of our fight to Make America Great Again!”
Remember, none carried guns inside the Capitol. An FBI spokesperson said that. None used knives inside the Capitol.
There intent? What? To overthrow with their flagpoles the Country, to overthrow the Capitol, against hundreds of fire-gun armed Capitol Police? Did that cadre think with a few score they’d outpower Capitol Police, the D.C. Police, the National Guard, the U.S. Army?
A little more reflection is needed. I admit that I too, at times, can be flippantly reflexive or reflexively flippant.
Skymiskov, all the gurus, all the liberals in Media, Academia, Law Schools, the ABA, the ACLU, the CLUM, the Boston Globe et cetera did not believe us who were defending the Free Speech Rights of the South Boston Allied War Veterans Council, organizers of the annual St. Patrick’s Day Parade.
Someone said, “One man on the side of God is a majority.” St. Thomas More.
Did not a poet said something like this: “Believe yourself when all Men doubt you, but make allowance for their doubts, too.”
No one believed Doug Flutie would throw that Miracle in Miami T.D. pass from the fifty yard line with few seconds left. It’s not over, until its over.
A few thoughts:
Of course, we conservatives do not share New York Times nor most liberals’ views. Muddled? Muddying the waters? Did you forget that on January 6, 2021, brilliant Patriotic Congressmen were filing motions opposing the confirmation of delegates, attempting to delay certification? Brilliant constitutional lawyers like Mark Levin and Sidney Powell have raised objections regarding the 2020 vote. Pugilistic-ly speaking, the match is not over until the final bell rings. Conservatives are not accustomed to throwing in their towels.
“Hard to disagree” with NYT. Hardly, Conservatives generally disagree entirely with NYT’s views. What NYT writings about Trump’s, Trump supporters, or Conservatives’ views have as much credibility as NYT’s did in the 1930s when it denied “hunger” existed in the Ukraine while millions were starving. NYT has not torn down the statue in its lobby of the reporter who saw no evil under Stalin.
Incendiary speech? Schumer’s threat during Coney’s Confirmation that Scotus will pay the price, the whirlwind is coming?
Back to today’s post: “They (Trump supporters) knew they could only do this by force.” False: They hoped demonstrations would persuade a few more Republicans to vote against confirming delegates. Why not a few more days to consider appeals? Why not a few more days to re-evaluate allegations of fraud? Why not await appeals, still pending, for decisions? Should the St. Patrick Day Parade organizers have given up after losing in courts for three years?
“What did Trump and his protesters want?” This is exactly what anti-Kavanaugh protesters wanted: a delay on the vote on Kavanaugh. Even after Kavanaugh was confirmed, protesters continued protesting for reconsideration. Trump wanted only a few more days, a “two day” delay, to persuade some Congressman to change their minds.
Onn Jan 6, they still had 14 days to go before Inauguration.
“I ask how were they planning to bring about this delay?”
The Same Answer: the same way the anti-Kavanaugh protesters hoped. They just wanted a little more time. Who knows how last-ditch efforts turn out? They needed to change just a few minds in Congress. Remember liberals falsely pushed for years to continue investigating Russian Collusion. Remember the South Boston Allied War Veterans did not “how” exactly how they could prevail against a corrupt judiciary, but they persevered and fought bravely to the end, against all odds, to receive a Constitutional victory for Free Speech at Scotus. (The Hurley case.)
Trump did not call on anyone “to cheat”; he asked officials to continue considering.
The NYT says Trump “DECISELY LOST.” No. Trump lost four states, GA, WI, AZ, PA, by 0.2%, 0.4%, 0.7%, AND 1.2%. He needed to reverse just three out of four.
Bidenites paint all Trump supporters as “radicals”, mindless, low-life deplorables. Want to understand Conservatives? Read columns by Sowell and Buchanan etc., read Ted Cruz’s 2020 book: “One Vote Away.” Want to understand “deplorables” read a common man’s views: Nolte’s column: “(Conservative) Trump Supporters Already Live in Safe, Tolerant (Rural) Utopia, Leftists Claim to Want”:
https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2021/04/12/nolte-rural-trump-voters-already-live-in-the-safe-tolerant-utopia-leftists-claim-to-want/
Read some intellectual conservatives: Paul Walkowski in Lawyer’s Weekly, (or in his book) Justice Joseph Nolan (editor of Black Law’s Dictionary); Charles Rice, Professor at Notre Dame Law School (a graduate of Holy Cross and Boston College Law); Mark Levin; re-read Doctor Thomas Sowell’s forty or so books.
Recounting counterfeit dollars will sum up the same. Recounting by leftists or liberal Dems or liberal RINOs will find similar sums. Mark Levin shows that the 2020 Presidential elections were constitutionally corrupt a priori, from the get go, in many states whose governors of judges revised their election processes, which only legislatures should have authorized.
“Be there, will be wild” evokes “Wild Thing” by the Trogs. “Wild thing she makes my heart sing.” It invoked Woodstock, a party, a wild time. Fun.
A man tells a friend that he thinks his brother is going nuts.
“He thinks he is a chicken and his wife is really worried.”
The other man suggests, “Why don’t you take him to a good psychiatrist? It might help.”
The first man answers, “I was considering that, but ya know, we really do need the eggs.”
Abe, I generally agree with you, sometimes agree with Msfreeh, occasionally agree with Khalid (introduced us to a humble woman who became a veritable Saint, advocate, liberator, politician in Egypt), but I don’t eat eggs anymore, although I used to like eggs easy over.
No eggs? How about caviar?
The end result of the election was fair. The numbers are the most unimportant part of the result. Its like when I use to hunt I realized that killing stuff was not why I was out there. I was down on The Mall the morning of the attack on The Capital. Early. I was taking a friend’s son to the methadone clinic down on F Street. By 8 am there were a few dozen busloads of people walking up towards the Capital. They were not the people that stormed the place. I asked a few of them what they were doing there and they said they wanted to peacefully protest the election results. Almost no one was over 30. Looked a lot like folks you would see heading to a Dead concert. Even carrying blankets and picnic baskets. The people that stormed the place should all go to jail. And the vets that are going to trial are in for a huge, rude awakening. (This is from a Lt. Col. I know) They are probably going to be reactivated, court martialed and lose all of their benefits. All of their bennies. That is huge. And face up to 20 years in jail. If that happens, tough luck.
So what book are you working on now?